Curse

sindex · Aug 14, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

So hypothetically a person bought an armbrace yesterday for 100K + 40 ectos and turned it in for a tormented weapon (customize too) has nothing to fear?

korcan · Aug 14, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

True; that said, recall the Dragon Festival mass-afk ban. If a ton of people got nailed, we'll hear the agonized screaming in the forums. This, by contrast, appears to be what Gaile is claiming it to be. So far I count representatives of 3 guilds complaining that a half-dozen members or so got banned.

if hundreds of people were perma-banned because they knowingly duped items, which they probably also knew was against the eula, what percentage of those people would post a "unban" me thread on these forums?

maybe a handful, if that?

i sure as hell wouldnt be posting a "unban me" thread if i knowingly exploited the game to increase my personal ingame wealth and got caught.

gene terrodon · Aug 14, 2007, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Ha...I say ha because everyone that got banned is a victim.
Their guild never did a thing, they never did a thing, they didn't know.
It's funny, people try to cheat, take shortcuts, etc. they get caught and all of a sudden the world is wrong and everyone is picking on them.
Who cares how many people got banned..10-100-10,000, idfm, the pointis that you cheated, got caught and now suffer the consequences. A good life lesson, use it later on.

In my experience, the ones that scream the loudest are the ones who are the most guilty.

And bringing up bots...that's a joke.
Different issue all together.

The Herbalizer · Aug 14, 2007, 04:02 AM // 04:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

True; that said, recall the Dragon Festival mass-afk ban. If a ton of people got nailed, we'll hear the agonized screaming in the forums. This, by contrast, appears to be what Gaile is claiming it to be. So far I count representatives of 3 guilds complaining that a half-dozen members or so got banned.

Which isn't the end of the world if these ectos were already tradered for cash, but could be problematic if they're still hiding on a bunch of accounts. Still, the market has soldiered on through previous ecto devaluations.

I am sure there are new, unknown people to us posting on other sites regarding their ban. GWOnline, GWLatino, Guild Hall, Foreign Language Sites etc. Then there are those who dont even most on forums.

Gaile Gray · Aug 14, 2007, 04:03 AM // 04:03

I must not have made myself clear. The comment about "single digit bans" was in relation to a guild where six members were reported as banned. The number of bans exceeded single digits, yes.

lakatz · Aug 14, 2007, 04:04 AM // 04:04

Dumb question maybe... but that's how I gain knowledge.

Everybody is focused on the armbraces, but were they able to duplicate the rare mini-pets they were so eager to pay a bazillion armbraces for as well using the same method Chunky Monkey detailed for us in the other thread (http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ostcount=909)? I mean if they were out in the mission with their Kanaxai, and they reconnected on two computers, did the Kanaxai reappear as well?

If it's possible, is there a way for ANet to count how many rare minis are in the wild now and compare to how many they actually released?

arcanemacabre · Aug 14, 2007, 04:05 AM // 04:05

Gaile, just want to say, you guys did a fantastic job cleaning this huge mess. Of course, there is still the issue about the hit to the economy, but I think it's fairly trivial and will work its way out (I hope).

At least now it's very clear how greedy people can be (OMG you're giving me 7 stacks of armbraces/ecto/tokens/blah for free!? Accept! Accept! Accept!). I kinda feel bad for anyone caught in the crossfire, and I hope they see justice, like the ones who thought they were legitimately selling their rare minipet for an [albeit super-high] offer of several armbraces, only to find they were accepting duped items and banned (I hope that didn't happen).

Lord High Pwner · Aug 14, 2007, 04:06 AM // 04:06

I dont get why people are still buggin on the one armbrace deals.Its been said in multiple threads by Gaile herself even. they are looking into this exstensivly and its deal with multi. armbraces that are banned. Shes even said that some that are banned now can get their accounts back with a simple e-mail. So for everyone concerned about getting an armbrace last week...breathe if you have nothing to worry about, dont worry.

Martin Alvito · Aug 14, 2007, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by korcan

if hundreds of people were perma-banned because they knowingly duped items, which they probably also knew was against the eula, what percentage of those people would post a "unban" me thread on these forums?

It was quite high, as I recall. What happened was that ANet ran a much more aggressive bot sweep than normal which apparently had looser parameters than it should have. A fair chunk of the posters here that weekend apparently were as guilty as could be and tried to play it off as though they were not.

You say you wouldn't come post an unban me thread, but then you wouldn't dupe, either. Someone that DID dupe has more of an interest than the average bear in restoring access to their account. Plus, anyone that has the unmitigated arrogance or greed to dupe items for personal profit probably also lacks the level of shame you or I would have about getting caught.

The Herbalizer · Aug 14, 2007, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

I must not have made myself clear. The comment about "single digit bans" was in relation to a guild where six members were reported as banned. The number of bans exceeded single digits, yes.

Then disregard everything I said about numbers being wrong etc.

Although it would be most interesting to eventually find out how many people got banned and a possible breakdown e.g. banned for duping, banned for accepting insane amounts of an item, banned for trading for insane amounts of an item etc. Would be a nice deterent for potential future EULA breakers.

spyke136 · Aug 14, 2007, 04:09 AM // 04:09

in response to Darth Zach's thread which is being appended here:

I'm getting incredibly annoyed by the so called experts on the situation, who, equipped with their 20/20 vision of the past, now cast doubt and blame on people who traded their rare minipets for the armbraces.

I don't understand why if a few months ago someone traded close to 3000 ectos for a crystalline, WHY would it be that impossible for someone to have accumulated through whatever means 250 armbraces.

get off of your high horses people, there is not ONE person who would not have made that trade ESPECIALLY if you only ended up giving many of them to your guild any way. and an island guardian is one of the rarest minipets, so to the person who said it's only worth 100k, gg for knowing the market.

screaming "ban them all" is ignorant. if you are a seller and you are offered more than what it is worth, it is only common sense to accept. did any one truly think there was a way to duplicate items in GW? if you say yes, you're full of shit. and it's irresponsible for Anet to put that blame on people.

Let's be honest, Max Gladius' thread is the only reason Anet knows anything about the duping, Fenix and his friend then informed Anet of how it was done BECAUSE they gained information through that thread. Anet had no idea what was going on before that thread was created, and if they dont know that items were being duped, why the hell should people like Zach be expected to? There is a big difference, though, between Zach and chunky. Zach made a trade, an insanely profitable trade which anyone would have taken. According to chunky though he was given 7(+) stacks of armbraces which would have tipped anyone off, something is wrong.

Cythean · Aug 14, 2007, 04:10 AM // 04:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by gene terrodon

Ha...I say ha because everyone that got banned is a victim.
Their guild never did a thing, they never did a thing, they didn't know.
It's funny, people try to cheat, take shortcuts, etc. they get caught and all of a sudden the world is wrong and everyone is picking on them.
Who cares how many people got banned..10-100-10,000, idfm, the pointis that you cheated, got caught and now suffer the consequences. A good life lesson, use it later on.

In my experience, the ones that scream the loudest are the ones who are the most guilty.

And bringing up bots...that's a joke.
Different issue all together.

Thank you!!! People please, you got banned, deal. If you plan to hack and cheat you don't deserve to play. If you don't have enough common sense to know what you are doing is wrong, or if something is wrong with what is going on (such as getting 250 armbraces for 100k or a minipet) then you shouldn't be playing GW because DING fries are ready!!! Common sense and a bit of inteligence help you determine what is right in real life, dont think being online makes a difference!!!

Sli Ander · Aug 14, 2007, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Swift

2: ANet repeatedly has assured players in the past that duping items was impossible because the information was all server side (thus assuaging some of the suspicion that would normally arise in the player's mind when being offered multiple armbraces)

3: ANet recently made DoA easier to access (and advertised this quite efficiently) leading to the reasonable assumption that armbraces and gemsets would fall in price quite rapidly.

To their knowledge duping was not possible, and such statements were made 'in the past', probably well before reconnects(as they are incredibly new). And even if DoA is easier to access, some of the numbers being offered were quite absurd, hence my next statement.

Quote:

4: I had no real idea myself how much an armbrace was worth in this game until this issue - many other players surely are in the same boat. Had I been offered one for 50k or even as a gift I would have known I was getting a good deal but I never would have realized how much of a good deal. If I had a rare mini and was offered a 1000 armbraces for it, I probably would not have realized the discrepancy. I collect certain things and know the price for them but anything else would simply leave me in the dark.

I'm rather out of the loop on certain things, as I'm semi-retired from the game. But even I know that an Armbrace of Truth is worth a phenomenal amount(if nothing else, in time and effort). The assumption is not that they'll realize that a single armbrace is worth a certain amount, but as several threads realized, having over 1000 offered makes some alarms go off. If I'm selling anything and were to get offered more than single digits for any item, I'd probably assume that something wasn't quite right, even if I didn't think "dupe"

Quote:

6: And finally - let's face it, this exploit has been around since December - and now that we look back was probably greatly responsible for the sharp drop in ecto prices. Yet NO ONE suspected anything other than deflation caused by hard mode and loot scaling. Why do you, then, expect people to see armbraces differently?

Yes, many are to blame - some may have suspected there was a problem - but given that ANet was responsible for a huge part of the problem I think you need to err strongly on the side of caution before claiming any person should have known there was a problem.

They are no more to blame than ANet - because ANet SHOULD HAVE SUSPECTED THERE WAS A PROBLEM LONG AGO!!!

Please do not say what others should have suspected when you must be painted with the same brush.

Hindsight is 20/20. Ecto drops back in December could have been explained by a lot of things I'm sure(though some may be a bit of a stretch). And as for saying they should have suspected there was a problem when people first started talking about it, did you? Everyone is always skeptical when something like this crops up, just like when the Legendary Defender of Ascalon title popped into existence. But now that suspicions have been confirmed by screenies, etc, Anet appears to be working round the clock to fix the problem. I wouldn't exactly call them a huge part of the problem for taking action when they knew what action to take...

But that's just my two cents

Edit: 1) Yes, what about the shiny things? what's being done about the shinies?
2) it rather sucks that this had to happen so soon after Gaile's b-day, kinda ruins the whole month...

Oofus · Aug 14, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by thechunkymonkey

i sent in lots of emails and i got one really mean one back from a gm saying that they where not gonna read any of my emails i just want my account back from this gaint mistake i was also put in..

How the hell do you still have the cajones to even show yourself, let alone continue to profess your innocence after that screenshot Max posted of you flashing 1,750 Armbraces? Just go away, and take your clan mates with you. Seriously!

Martin Alvito · Aug 14, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakatz

Everybody is focused on the armbraces, but were they able to duplicate the rare mini-pets they were so eager to pay a bazillion armbraces for as well using the same method Chunky Monkey detailed for us in the other thread

The problem there would have been finding ways to move them. What broke this whole thing to light was offers of thousands of armbraces for Kanaxai/Panda. It appears that the people that were foolish enough to get caught wanted those minis so that they could do exactly what you propose.

There are problems with duping the high-end minis for profit, however. The market for potential buyers is quite small. Reselling them in quantity would raise antennae just as the offers of huge numbers of armbraces did; the potential buyers of such items know the patterns of resale for these items and also know one another quite well.

Why take on these logistical problems when you can just dupe stacks of armbraces/ectos anyway? Both are much easier to move and convert into other forms of wealth.

If these pets were duped, they were duped by someone that knew about the dupe for months and was smart enough to produce only limited quantities and release them into the marketplace slowly. Or they were duped by someone who saw the writing on the wall and stashed them on alts that had nothing to do with the duping, so as to have them to sell after this whole mess blows over.

It's a safe bet that some of the existing supply of minis were lost forever on accounts that were duping, however (as these transactions are known to have occurred).

anna · Aug 14, 2007, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Those who made an innocent purchase have very little to worry about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Be smart, people! It's not worth risking your freedom for a stolen TV. It's not worth risking your account for a duped in-game item, no matter how sparkly they are!

First, I just wanted to thank you for talking to the community about the actions being taken.

Questions: (if they've already been asked and answered, I apologize)

(1) Right now, can we safely buy and sell armbraces without fear of having our accounts banned?

"Very little to worry about" is actually a LOT to worry about when we're talking about banned accounts.

(2) Will the reconnect feature be back, and if so, when?

I really don't want to enter DoA until reconnects are resumed. Hopefully, they'll be added back soon.

Thanks Gaile.

Joseph Rejekt · Aug 14, 2007, 04:29 AM // 04:29

Since this is the fresher string, I think maybe I could re-post this and somehow achieve the appropriate notice and response.\

Whatever happens in the armbrace issue happens.. the one issue i'm SICK OF READING AND HEARING ABOUT IS ECTOS!!

Guys... let's set the record straight. Over the winter we had winterfest.. everyone was on break.. people were beating Nightfall with their paragons and dervies and ectos became a commodity because well.. FoW armor on their new characters. Makes sense right? Now.. between that time and when Hard Mode came around... ectos dropped to 9k each at the mat trader. Seeing as the market is something I actively watch, this is something i paid attention to. Now... with that said, when Hard Mode was unleashed and suddenly scrolls came about for access to UW during times we didn't have favor, it exposed the ability to play in UW even more. Hard Mode introduced increased drops, UW scrolls introduced more chances for that to happen. Now... there was something that for a couple weeks i'd noticed that a lot of the long time players actually sold all their ectos, equip... everything and hoarded their gold and quit GW. I noticed this because a few friends of mine did it... several posts were here on guru of people actually selling their ectos and not in OVER abundance. I have 294 ectos myself. I want you guys to think about all these factors for a moment. One more thing to mention and i'm sure someone is going to want to say something... LOOT SCALING! For those who know it know that rare mats are unaffected by Loot Scaling, meaning that a person can still solo UW and farm ectos on his or her own. So you wanna know what happened to ectos? Look no further than what i just read. Are ectos duped? If they were duped... you honestly think they'd be 5.5k? No! Ectos would be about the same price as your ambers, jades, and steel ingots... NOT around the price of a ruby or diamond. So lets get our heads outta our backsides and wake up. One more thing... Ectos did spike briefly this past Thursday/Friday to 7k and then dropped suddenly (as expected) when the festival started. For those who have paid attention over the years... when a festival comes to town, ectos drop. Feel free to speculate, criticize... whatever all you want. You take 5 - 10 min to really think about it... look into it... see how ectos didn't just suddenly DROP overnight but rather trickled down over what was actually months... you'll see that I'm right.

lellyville · Aug 14, 2007, 04:35 AM // 04:35

don't blam anet blame the dupers if they never duped then there will never be a mass banning

Oofus · Aug 14, 2007, 04:35 AM // 04:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph Rejekt

Since this is the fresher string, I think maybe I could re-post this and somehow achieve the appropriate notice and response.\

Whatever happens in the armbrace issue happens.. the one issue i'm SICK OF READING AND HEARING ABOUT IS ECTOS!!

Guys... let's set the record straight. Over the winter we had winterfest.. everyone was on break.. people were beating Nightfall with their paragons and dervies and ectos became a commodity because well.. FoW armor on their new characters. Makes sense right? Now.. between that time and when Hard Mode came around... ectos dropped to 9k each at the mat trader. Seeing as the market is something I actively watch, this is something i paid attention to. Now... with that said, when Hard Mode was unleashed and suddenly scrolls came about for access to UW during times we didn't have favor, it exposed the ability to play in UW even more. Hard Mode introduced increased drops, UW scrolls introduced more chances for that to happen. Now... there was something that for a couple weeks i'd noticed that a lot of the long time players actually sold all their ectos, equip... everything and hoarded their gold and quit GW. I noticed this because a few friends of mine did it... several posts were here on guru of people actually selling their ectos and not in OVER abundance. I have 294 ectos myself. I want you guys to think about all these factors for a moment. One more thing to mention and i'm sure someone is going to want to say something... LOOT SCALING! For those who know it know that rare mats are unaffected by Loot Scaling, meaning that a person can still solo UW and farm ectos on his or her own. So you wanna know what happened to ectos? Look no further than what i just read. Are ectos duped? If they were duped... you honestly think they'd be 5.5k? No! Ectos would be about the same price as your ambers, jades, and steel ingots... NOT around the price of a ruby or diamond. So lets get our heads outta our backsides and wake up. One more thing... Ectos did spike briefly this past Thursday/Friday to 7k and then dropped suddenly (as expected) when the festival started. For those who have paid attention over the years... when a festival comes to town, ectos drop. Feel free to speculate, criticize... whatever all you want. You take 5 - 10 min to really think about it... look into it... see how ectos didn't just suddenly DROP overnight but rather trickled down over what was actually months... you'll see that I'm right.

Well maybe if your post was coherent and actually had a point you might have gotten a response the 1st time you posted it, but since it isn't and doesn't...... What are you on about?

sindex · Aug 14, 2007, 04:35 AM // 04:35

The terms go something like this:

#19

Quote:

You will not exploit any bug in Guild Wars and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug (bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits) either directly or through public posting, to any other user of Guild Wars. Bugs should be promptly reported via "Ask a Question" at http://support.guildwars.com.

GW rules of conduct